New bug-using

  • Original thread:


    Bug using clarification


    So what is the logic for 20 seconds? Is it because the game is so broken and slow that 20 seconds can prevent fleet escape? It’s going to make safety probing less safe and I reckon there’s going to be a load of accidental bans going on. 10 seconds seems reasonable to me.


    Edit: could you also clarify if what happens if a player has an acs defend land 10 seconds before a fleet im timing back? Can I crash the acs defend and the timeback? Or is that bug using?


    also what happens if the defender has multiple fleets returning close together, can I crash them all?


    also, what happens if I send my follow ups close together?

    Space Pyrate

  • I'm trying to understand this change to the rule.

    Bug using rule clarification update


    kewlness


    So we can no longer spy 20 seconds before impact? That's kind of game breaking change and it only shows there's something seriously wrong in the back end and the way combats are calculated and must have been for past few update iterations.

    Those 20 seconds used to be enough to spy and determine whether to recall is or let the attack proceed.

    It takes the fun out of the game


    Gameforge had revenue of 78M USD last year they can pay the devs well.



    I was gonna spend money on DM but I'm going to hold off see where it goes in next few months. I'm realizing i'm starting to sound like nanogram but this is starting to be ridiculous.

    When the "merge" item will become i can already predict this will be used by those whale accounts to jump between unis after they finished wiping them clean (Prove me wrong).


    piink please tell your employers "well done" (sarc.)

  • Original thread:


    Bug using clarification


    So what is the logic for 20 seconds? Is it because the game is so broken and slow that 20 seconds can prevent fleet escape? It’s going to make safety probing less safe and I reckon there’s going to be a load of accidental bans going on. 10 seconds seems reasonable to me.

    I ninja'd a guy a couple of days ago and wondered why he didnt safety probe in the last 10 seconds maybe you're right.

    s7zOCYX.jpeg

  • ah crap. I just posted the same.

    Yeah what they keep referring to as the back end must be completely effed


    Quote

    So we can no longer spy 20 seconds before impact? That's kind of game breaking change and it only shows there's something seriously wrong in the back end and the way combats are calculated and must have been for past few update iterations.

    Those 20 seconds used to be enough to spy and determine whether to recall is or let the attack proceed.

    It takes the fun out of the game


    This rule change is idiotic, I have no other words for it



    re acs and follow up attacks - Andy has legit questions, most people would be aiming to time those well close to the actual attack.



    either the infra or the code is so effed or some heavy dm spender cried to the execs at gf...

  • 20 seconds is stupid, I would be timing my safety probe for 20 secs which is just enough time to recall an attack fleet nowdays ... surely 10 seconds is reasonable, also agree we need clarification on the acs defend issue and stacking multiple follow up's after an attack - I've seen it done when these were all in the same second ...

    Asimov_Laws.jpg

    Best Solo - 8.2 bn Profit - Uni1.org
    Best ACS - 320 bn Profit - Uni1.org

  • If you are safety probing, slow your fleet.

    This should steer you clear of getting ninja'd and a bug using violation.


    As for why this was decided the way it was is due to a couple of cases where fleets were locked.


    When I timed it, it took about 3-4 seconds to do a combat calculation which completely locks the fleet.

    Add in the fact it takes an average of 8 seconds to send a fleet (more if lag is involved) and you are already at 12 seconds to send a fleet after being probed.


    To be honest, I hope this is a band-aid (as bad a band-aid as it is, mind you) and the issues are fixed soon.

    The clarification is a reflection of the current state of the game.

  • So we are to ACS slow down the fleet, to give the opponent yet extra time to move fleet or ninja in order not to get banned or ninjaed. It's a vicious circle then kewlness


    It takes 1 click to spy on target = defo less than 8 seconds

  • Another thing to ruin fleeter's game and help others.


    There is also a bug, where attacks don't happen. You get the combat report as a tie with no loss no win, not even a round initiate which I already reported.


    Sad to see every day that the bugs "always affects" fleeters and never miners or turtles .


    I think we need more clarification on this situation otherwise there will many people getting banned

  • None of the game staff determine what is bug using.

    That determination is made solely by Gameforge.

    If a ban is handed out it is because Gameforge says it is warranted.


    The bug using rule does not specifically state every possible bug which can be exploited nor does it cover all cases.

    Each decision is made on a case-by-case basis as every case is different.


    I honestly do not foresee any more bans being handed out then are normally handed out for this case - which is very few honestly.

  • Doubt it will be policed - previously happened to me on the 6s terms, admin said, "as it could not be proven there was intent," nothing would be done.


    It's a pretty B&W rule that mentions intent nowhere. Person even doing it to me admitted why he did it.

  • I think it's bit simplistic to say that if "you slow your fleet you are safe from ninja and bug using"


    This is a fundamental change to fleeting dynamics and gives huge margins of error in what you do. I very much hope it is a "band aid" as you describe, but let's face it, GF doesn't exactly have great stock in fixing major issues atm.


    Favourite internal quotes so far:

    Lord of Ice "They may as well just ban attacks and be done with it"

    Firestorm "Let's fix the rules rather than the game"


    I've spent years checking within the last 10-15 seconds. For an attacker, it's perfectly legitimate and possible to probe and recall if needed in that time frame. The rule is far too simplistic. I understand rules for lagging defenders on timed missions. But the old rules already accounted for that. The new rule, with a blanket ban on missions within 20 secs is just classic GF clumsy with little afterthought. Who is it helping? In my experience, defenders who leave it that late to move are absolute morons or bots. So why are we protecting them with a pointless rule change? Assuming the defender is online during the attack, they know there is the possibility that if they leave it late, the server might lag. This is ogame after all. It is their choice. The remote likelihood of a defender appearing within the last 20 sec and this rule making a difference is completely negligible in my mind. You're penalising active players on infinitesimal technicalities

    Space Pyrate

  • I agree, it's too easy for now to GF to say: "oh now you got to be more careful on slowing down and etc". I personally think it's a bunch of bananas, not to say the correct word because in the end it's just complicating what is simple.


    So now I guess this is just a new thing where we are fleets will slow down and to gamble puting probes before the attack to prevent ninja and a counter ninja which I can see GF must not know what it is because this is just helping ninjas 100% and we have to leave the decision that "we intended to lock in fleet". Just ridiculous.


    Im 100% sure they will be bans incoming next weeks on top players because of this confusing rule.


    And if the reply that I will most likely get is the political "slow your fleet and you are ok", well them you are completely wrong, no matter how much you slow down you can get easy ninja when peaceful speed is 6x. Complete nonsense.


    But I'm sure still people won't read what I said and give me the political response as usual


    EDIT: to not also mention how the timer are ahead, some targets are supposed to have a timer at second 30 for example and the timer appears on second 28 :fatgreengrin::lol:

    Edited once, last by shadex ().

  • Completely farcical rule change to patch cracks in the game rather than for any user demand. There are so many situations where this just makes no sense at all.


    So I am destroying a player's moon and I send a cover fleet, I now can't slow that cover fleet past my first MD wave because that's now bugusing?


    I am timing back multiple fleets landing in close proximity using an efficient number of ships in each wave, thats bugusing?


    I attack a larger player and split my fleet into different parts, they come online and I recall them all at the same time. I am now immune from being timed back because their attack on one of my fleets would land too close to another landing?


    How far does it extend? Does it apply if I send a fleet at any of the defender's planets or just the planet I am attacking? Why am I expected to know what game actions generate lag?


    Who gets banned if this does happen? If I am being timed back by another player can I just get a buddy to make a new account and probe before the attack, thereby getting the attacking player banned for buguse?


    I know you don't make this shit up Kewlness but please feed back just how half baked this idea is to the people who pull the strings. It is one of the most poorly thought out rule changes I have ever seen made and that is saying something when it comes to ogame

  • How far does it extend? Does it apply if I send a fleet at any of the defender's planets or just the planet I am attacking? Why am I expected to know what game actions generate lag?

    also, how do i slow recyclers already in flight? what if i already have slowed my fleet and can't slow it down any further as the recyclers would arrive before the attack

    I second that, why players are expected to knoe what generates lag.

    How MD and phalanx? This rule basically renders phalanx useless, I can send fleet+res away below 20s easily

  • If they want to mitigate the impact it should be coupled with changes in the amount of slowing an acs can do. Slowing by over 20 seconds late into a flight is going to be challenging if you don’t do it super early

    Space Pyrate