Lifeforms - Feedback thread

This lifeform feature is out of hand and available to exploit Prongs I hope you know what I am talking about.

Please dont bring it to live universes like this. Change a few things, limit some things!!! People can exploit the NUMBERS...

ajanga

Developers were notified about the...various ways to exploit the current system. Some they were aware of already and the fix is a work in progress, some were new.

I'll make a writeup about the safer issues here this evening / tomorrow, as well as cap and balance suggestions; from many viewpoints.

Haven't given deep thought or ran the numbers about parts of the update yet - such as mine production - just didn't have the time, will add it eventually.

As for the bugs, haven't tested everything yet, of course, but now I have the means to.

On that note, if someone needs resources, contact "HereWeGoAgain" in game(no need to reply in this thread, let's keep it on feedback). I don't have many ships to transport them with, but I certainly can speed it up for those who want to test the later stages in the new update.

Just remember that testing balance in the early development is also important.

The simplest and most straightforward solution I see is to do one of the following: either a) eliminate the possibility of techs increasing production across the entire account or b) scaling back the tech trees so there are fewer techs. 6 per life form seems good since there are plenty of techs that are the same in different trees. Or c) turn some of these techs that increase production into regular research technologies.

Quote from Prongs

Since the beginning it was also clear that Lifeforms is too much content

I think for me, this is the main thing.. as a long term goal / plan.. this might not be a horrible update.

But I'm talking long term.. phased in slowly over the next year, maybe eighteen months.

Otherwise if GF drops this on the community in one go, I can see this having the opposite impact on the game that GF hopes, it will take what is ultimatly a rather simple game (over-all) and turn it into a custer frack of choices and force people away. In some speed unis, you have the potential of being crashed in the time it takes to properly input all the choices for a seperate attack.

It will also do the same as the MCO did, just increasing / boosting the rate of income etc isn't always a good thing. You can't combat the monster accounts the MCO created by pushing through even more monster accounts.

The other thing about phasing the thing through it will give the sims devs a chance to (maybe) update to take the new options into account. Unless GF will be finally be releasing an official sim before this patch drops.

Due to the size of the update, this needs a LONG testing phase, we're talking months, not a matter of days or weeks. It would also help GF by a staggered release, so they can focus their bug fixing in certain areas instead of across the entire thing.

I mostly agree with Wraith but at the same time I’ve been playing with it for a week now and it’s a lot less complicated than it seems initially.

I do have a few questions though.

what are the class bonuses found in Tier 3 of the tech trees actually boosting? That needs to be explained better.

Do the tech bonuses that apply to ships (ie cargo capacity found in slot 4 of the Rock’tal tree) apply to the moon on that planet as well, or just the planet?

suggestions

there’s too much doubling down on techs. Espionage Tech bonus appears 3 times, bonuses metal/crystal/deut appear multiple times etc. It might be nice to see a couple of these converted. Increased storage capacity for current res storages could be one.

It’s too hard to find life forms. I don’t mind the frequency of finding nothing vs finding something but it’s 2 clicks to send one mission. Way too much clicking feels too much like trying to send a wave of expos.

I feel like there’s too many choices. I wouldn’t mind seeing the tier 3 techs being locked in like a specialty tree, so what ever species you have on the planet is what you’re stuck with for techs

I like that some of these researches receive time and cost reductions. There are some that could probably appear somewhere that don’t. Ie Computer tech, hyperspace tech, IRN, and dare I say (If some of the current boosts are nerfed) Astrophysics…at least on a time reduction

some of the slot based bonuses slot 6-10 metal boost and slot 1-4 crystal bonus could be axed or reduced or at least scaled on temp like deut.

I believe many of the issues have been covered quite well so far via the other threads and the Discord channel, but I'll just hop in with my 2c.

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1. As I mentioned in the thread linked by OP, the building queue is very much a Quality of Life issue with each building/tech being planet specific. I still don't look forward to manually clicking one by one 1,200+ lifeform buildings over my 15 planets as soon as this goes live. For me with a 1.2b point account on Tarazed .US, I will be completing most buildings up to level 50 in 1 second. So I will not have time to queue multiple before the page refreshes from the prior level completing.

Adding a button to do something like "queue next 5/10 levels" and/or removing the page refresh upon building/tech/shipyard completion would make this much easier.

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2. As others have discussed elsewhere, this update is going to heavily reinforce the Collector / Miner playstyle and Metal Package spam.

I don't personally mind the production boost, but I do believe the Metal Package spamming meta needs to be addressed for overall health / balance of the game.

I have seen some ideas, like capping how many can be purchased, increasing the cost, and/or disabling the DM res trader to force building of more than just Metal Mines. I believe the cap and price increases are fine, but am hesitant about the DM trader being completely removed without having something to replace it that will be nearly as easy to use. Perhaps return the marketplace with only Res trading enabled between certain values?

An idea I had regarding the Resource packages is to remove their connection to a players daily production and instead have them scale based on the points of the top player on the server. This allows more diversity in how/where people set planets up, and would equalize the value of what any player on the server is getting for their money. Also gives newer/smaller players an easier option to catch up if they desire.

An example of how this would work:

Say the top account on the server has 1,000,000,000 points. The Resource Packages would give M/C/D equal to 75%/50%/25% of those points. So, with that example, 750kk Metal, 500kk Crystal, and 250kk Deuterium. Numbers could be tuned, but just an example following standard 3/2/1 rates.

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3. Now, time for what will likely be a controversial thought.

If we're leaning into each planet being uniquely setup, then I believe player classes should also be planet specific. As is, everyone I know is going to remain a Collector and go with the Rock'tal race.

What if we could have a planet being the "Discoverers" of our empire and using that one planet to take advantage of the Discoverer playstyle. Likewise for having a planet/mobile colony setup as the General class that is focused on the Fleeter playstyle.

Some may disagree with this as it means you could spam Expos from one planet while still benefiting from Collector on your other planets. That's true, but I'd counter that with you having certain planet(s) you do expos from, that means other players could use that against you to steal DF or to look for gaps knowing your fleet will often be there.

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4. Edit: Just wanted to add that Expos need to start scaling past 100m points.

100m is an easily achieved number on most servers now. It would be very beneficial to those pursuing the Expo / Discoverer playstyle if this system continued scaling to what is seen in the modern state of the game. As is, being capped at 100m means Expos are not able to compete vs the Collector/Miner playstyle once your account has reached decent mine levels.

I haven't had an opportunity to test the lifeform boosts for Expos, but regardless, the playerbase on most older servers have far exceeded the 100m tier.

I do not understand the logic behind spending metal and crystal to search for lifeforms.

The search uses a fleet slot, so it's a flight, performed by some invisible non-specified ships, and all flights consume deuterium. So what are metal and crystal used for? Do they get burnt into a ceremonial pire as a propitiatory rite for a successful search?

Quote from Supernoob

I do not understand the logic behind spending metal and crystal to search for lifeforms.

The search uses a fleet slot, so it's a flight, performed by some invisible non-specified ships, and all flights consume deuterium. So what are metal and crystal used for? Do they get burnt into a ceremonial pire as a propitiatory rite for a successful search?

I understand your point but every time you discover a life form you get XP which increases the bonuses you get from life forms. So it needs to cost something otherwise you’re theoretically scaling your account simply by clicking and finding life forms.

Quote from johocknut

Quote from Supernoob

I do not understand the logic behind spending metal and crystal to search for lifeforms.

The search uses a fleet slot, so it's a flight, performed by some invisible non-specified ships, and all flights consume deuterium. So what are metal and crystal used for? Do they get burnt into a ceremonial pire as a propitiatory rite for a successful search?

I understand your point but every time you discover a life form you get XP which increases the bonuses you get from life forms. So it needs to cost something otherwise you’re theoretically scaling your account simply by clicking and finding life forms.

I never said the search for lifeform should come for free. What i am questioning is why this flight should consume metal and crystal. So, even if i agree with you when you say that "it should cost something", you're not addressing my concern at all by saying so.

The search is a flight. Consistency would require that it would consume deuterium only, like any other flight.

what about the cost of that ship thats searching?

that has to cost metal and xtal no? : o

and whats wrong with
"...theoretically scaling your account simply by clicking..."

??

Quote from Asto Vidatu

what about the cost of that ship thats searching?

that has to cost metal and xtal no? : o

Where is that ship, then?

I don't see any ships being built when sending a search. I just see metal and crystal being eaten up.

i would love to test this, but my account has been bugged with not being able to generate ANY RESOURCE for the past week.

Seems this is more important than the other bugs, and it was left out. i literaly cant make 1 metal

Quote from Arcticwarfare

i would love to test this, but my account has been bugged with not being able to generate ANY RESOURCE for the past week.

Seems this is more important than the other bugs, and it was left out. i literaly cant make 1 metal

This happens when your population is over the cap. Adding or deconstructing a habitat-type building will fix it.

Prongs

I just have one question please, the Mobile version will be released at the same time? Or the ideia is to release the Mobile App first without the Lifeforms update?

Thank you and sorry for my bad English!

thanks for the free res to hereWegoagain

but building up a col with lifeforms to complete each tier takes a huge amount of res and DM

it seems this update is only going to be useful to the super accounts with almost unlimited res

How is it even possible that ranks are exploding in growth on the pts

Before

later the same day

After

Quote from The Queen

How is it even possible that ranks are exploding in growth on the pts

Before

later the same day

After

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People are getting the cost of buildings to 0% and are able to freely build things up as far as they want. Some people are taking it as far as possible. I stopped after climbing from a few mil points to the 73b I'm at now. Put myself in VM to await the patch bringing fixed values and caps.

They have stated that caps are intended to be here to limit the cost reduction. So this is an issue already resolved internally, just have to wait for the patch that brings those caps in. I believe the cap for building cost reduction is meant to be 95%. So at best you'll have to pay 5% of the cost of these buildings with the current intended design.

I dont find the information ingame, it is all RP text but nothing explains me how I can get new lifeforms on my planet. My account on PTS is fairly new and I havent unlocked all human techs yet, how do I do from there ?

thanks

1. Once you have access to the Human techs, the very first tech you will be able to slot is "Intergalactic Envoys".
2. Level "Intergalactic Envoys" up to at least level 1. Higher levels increase speed of the lifeform searching missions.
3. Head over to galaxy view and you'll see a purple button on empty planet slots to the right of the colonization/relocation buttons.
4. Click that purple button and accept the prompt that pops up to build the ship for that mission.
5. Repeat this on as many slots as you can. If it says "you don't have access" just go over a system. It's a bit buggy right now. Just keep at it and be ready to spam these. You will need to spam a few dozen to find all the races.