Slot 8 vs Slot 15

    Greetings everyone,


    i am aware of that this topic has recently been discussed many times but as a recent cameback veteran player I wanted to ask and share some ideas about it.


    I had a break from this for 3 years. At that time all my planets were at slot 15. To achieve it, I had colonized planets firstly on slot 13, tried to get 200+ fields, builded terraformer there and reached 250+ fields and then relocated to 15. At the end of the that I had 13 planets on slot 15. However with a new update, I see that slot 8 provides 35% metal bonus. Currently my 7 planets are on slot 8 and 6 are on slot 15.


    My questions:

    1) Can I, one day, relocate my planets from 8 to 15? Because it was restricted before and it was only possible between 13-14-15 slots.

    2) It seems like slot 15 is totally useless now. Metal daily package gives you more resources (even in fair trade ratio) and costs three times cheaper than deuterium resource package. So my question is why deuterium resource package costs three times more? Because you are already producing it much less. Currently I get 290 million metal for 60 dark matter but 85 million deuterium for 180 dark matter. What is the point of using deuterium package?

    3) It seems like my invest has been powercreeped by Gameforge. I have spent many DMs to get these slot 15 planets but at the current situation it is just a fantasy to colonize on slot 15 and nothing else. Why do they do that?

    4) What is your final advise? Slot 8 or slot 15?


    Thanks.

    Answer to all of your questions: 8th slot.


    1) Yes, you can.


    2) You are right, it's was probably a brainfart on GF part to even give packages different prices. But I believe Lifeform update fixes just that: all packages will cost the same.


    3) No real awswer. 15th slot is still second best one. But 8th slot is the best, in general.


    4) 8th slot.

    if u plan on buying dm and packages go slot 8

    if you don't intend on buying packages slot 8 and 15 are close enough it will come down to do u want to have extra deut for fleets/trading to alliance members


    also if using merchant u get batter rates trading deut

    nothing has been said about changing the prices of res packs for v9, so I wouldn’t hold my breath on that

    I have a fleeter account with all on slot 15 (from free relocations), but I sort of regret it. If I had to actually pay the relocations, I would absolutely never do it.


    Temperatures vary and if you want to get the best out of it you need multiple relocations. On average you'll have the same production as on slot 8's (3:1 ratio), but if you want crawlers you will need fusion, which will than eat the part of the production. With lifeforms it seems even more energy will be needed, so slot 8 wins, even without taking packages into consideration.

    And you dont even mention miner like me who gathered resources and make energy technology 23 and fusion plants 23 to use slot 15 without the need of any solar satelities and with crowlers overcloked 150%

    I think gameforge need to balance packages to make any choice viable, why temperature still a factor?? Other slots metal and Crystal have fix % bonus, i think its time to fix % bonus to cold slots, but higher bonus than metal e Crystal have, since cold slots are the hardest to keep "working" and hot slots are total brainless.

    My Idea

    Slot 13 - 35% bonus deut production

    Slot 14 - 40% bonus deut production

    Slot 15 - 45% bonus deut production

    ??? This does nothing to balance anything. If you're comparing slots the best possible coldest slot 15 planet is on bar in terms of production with a slot 8 if you're able to trade that deut for metal and crystal. An extra 45% deut is weird. Simply fixing the crystal problem properly in the first place would have been sufficient to solve most of the resource imbalance issues we're having now.

    Quote from Kelenken

    I have a fleeter account with all on slot 15 (from free relocations), but I sort of regret it. If I had to actually pay the relocations, I would absolutely never do it.


    Temperatures vary and if you want to get the best out of it you need multiple relocations. On average you'll have the same production as on slot 8's (3:1 ratio), but if you want crawlers you will need fusion, which will than eat the part of the production. With lifeforms it seems even more energy will be needed, so slot 8 wins, even without taking packages into consideration.

    my lvl 23 fusions (lvl 23 energy) uses 16,475 per hour but i make 909,117 they cost all most nothing to run and there is no risk u get from sats

    Check the temperatures on slot 8. Temperatures stays same after merge (I don't know if this aplie to merging through graveyard). Maybe now you have planets on slot 8 with -120 °C, you won bingo :)

    I've given these questions some thought, and some things bother me. I don't find the answer satisfying. My following thoughts are discussions, so treat them as such. My focus here will be slot 8 vs slot 15 from a miner's perspective. As in, no packages (except one case which I'll tell more about later). As some already stated above, the packages are (very) unbalanced -> listen to my new friend mtndewuni1. As the old unis looking now (without lifeforms) metal packages are overpowered. Depending on how balanced your mines are you'll get about 3 times more ress than deu packages. Nevertheless, if you are not interested in packages here are my findings (hope you like math):


    First off, it's important to discuss the costs of the mines (which I rarely see in these discussions). Let's consider the case where you have spent about the same ress on each mine type. My example is 44/38/40 (M/C/D). Before all go bonkers and toxic and whatnot, I simplify things by using the ratio 3/2/1. Note, that with this setup I've spent more ress on metal mine than deu synth. As my crystal production will be the same on slot 8 as on slot 15, I will not add the production from these.

    Some info:

    eco setting is set to 8

    plasma tech is set to 19

    I use collector class with traders alliance class, note that crawlers are in use with 150% efficiency.

    energy tech is set to 22

    Why these settings? Because it's what I play, deal with it :gamer:


    So, slot 8 productions with avg temp = 10 deg and only using sats, looks like this (1 day production):

    Metal = 38284584

    Deu = 8267472

    Translated to metal only = 38284584*1 + 8267472*3 = 63087000


    Slot 15, avg temp = -110 deg, fusion lvl 23 (90%) and solar plant lvl 30 (1 day production):

    Metal = 32404680

    Deu = 10917960

    Translated to metal only = 32404680*1 + 10917960*3 = 65158560


    So I get more ress with slot 15 (65158560 > 63087000). Note that this is with fusion on slot 15 only, the production would of course be better with only sats. I'll let the reader think about it themselves if it is a good idea to have that. Also, note that the avg temp on slot 8 is very good and on slot 15 it is bad. And here is the kicker, what ratio would yield a better metal production value? With this setup it is:

    (38284584-32404680)/(10917960-8267472) = 2.22

    What this tells us is that if we sell the difference in deu for 2.22 or better ratio, we get more value in having slot 15 with the mentioned setup above. As an example:

    the difference in deu is 10917960-8267472 = 2650488

    we want this to cover the "loss" of metal, hence:

    32404680+2.22*2650488 = 38288763 (which is greater than 38284584)

    a small check:

    32404680+2.2*2650488 = 38235753 (which is lower than 38284584)

    The beauty with this is that the ratio gets even lower with a better avg temp on slot 15. So if you sell for 2.5 or more, you get lots of value.



    Some discussions:

    First off, don't just say slot 8 is better. It highly depends on what mines you have. As an example, you have a lvl 50 metal mine and lvl 30 deu synth. Of course, the metal production is better. It would be better on slot 15 as well. You can obviously turn this argument the other way around with higher deu syth than metal mine.

    For me, I'm more interested in the difference in productions of the two slots than the actual production.

    Note that the calcs above are just for one planet. It adds up more with more planets.

    I've also studied the case with crystal mines compared to the other mines but cannot find any reason (to make profit) to move to slot 1, even though the 40% buff. Would like to hear your thoughts about it.

    Additionally, slot 8 can be better. I'd argue it depends much on the avg temp. But, as my newfound friend mtndewuni1 stated, the difference is small.

    Lastly, the most important thing is that you choose what you enjoy the most (answer to question 4).


    But the case with packages I should tell you about? That my friend is the rewards event. Choose the one that gives you the most value (if you want the most value). For my case above I earn more with deu packages. But again, do what you want to do (as long as it is within game rules as some plebs does not want to do -> looking at you Vega <3).


    Enough boring text,

    Love you guys :flowers:

    One thing you don't consider is the future. Metal mines are much cheaper to build. All you have to do is sell deut for crystal and not to worry about metal.


    Duet mines get very expensive, crystal demanding. You will have shortages of both crystal and metal.


    If you're hardcore, you can easily keep colonizing for a perfect slot 8 planet (around -10 temp). To get a perfect slot 15 planet you will spend several relocations per planet.


    If you want to consider lifeforms, there are more things which improve metal production than deut.


    Bottom line, slot 8 miner will grow faster than slot 15. It just depends what you personally prefer and if you have fleeter friends to feed.

    So, the future was not considered. As I was saying I considered the current unis (no lifeforms). But okay, I don't know much about the lifeforms and cannot speak more about it. But! The argument can be turned around, as none of us know future plans and so on. We currently know the near future.


    How is metal mines cheaper? Can you provide an example?

    My example was that a lvl 40 deu synth beats lvl 44 metal mine, and yes lvl 40 deu synth is cheaper both in metal and crystal cost. Another example lvl 46 deu synth beats lvl 50 metal mine with the same calcs I made above.


    If you already trading with the merchant you can always trade deu for metal. So I don't see the same shortage as you do. But, you might know something that I don't. Please enlighten me if so. Another argument for slot 15 is that you don't need as many transport ships as you do with slot 8, as you are carrying more ress. But, this is just a minor thing that can be tweaked.


    But I do recognize that if you are free to play, slot 8 beats slot 15 due to field constraints, and as you are saying you can keep colonizing for that perfect temp. Note that my example above beats -10 deg as well even with a bad slot 15 avg temp. As in I'm being conservative with the numbers.


    Again, this is min-maxing. The bottom line is a personal preference.

    Your numbers for metal production seem to be a bit off. Slot 8 should be a straight 35% increase in metal compared to slot 15, which it wasn't for your calculation. Last time i did the math i believe it came out that at 3/2/1 slot 15 was better by a small amount and at 2.5/1.5/1 slot 8 closed the gap to less than 1 or 2%, but i don't remember what mine lvls i used to calculate, so i might have been off in terms of comparable costs (i got closer results than your example, though). Also i have no idea what lifeforms might do to production, and obviously, if you're buying packs, slot 8 is the way to go.


    I agree with you that for f2p slot 8 is better, as you can get really close in terms of production (especially as you can min max temps and get every planet with 30º max temp). On average i'd say i need 30+ colony tries to get a 250+ field and 30º max temp on slot 8, so assuming you want to min max on slot 15, that's a lot of DM on relocations. Btw if a merge happens, you might have to do this all over again for slot 8 which sucks if you're f2p and min maxed temps before merging, since you need the position as well as the temp, whereas with slot 15 you keep the temp and the position doesn't matter.


    Also since metal mines are much cheaper on crystal they'll be easier to upgrade (even if overall cost is higher you'll always have excess metal and less need to use merchant, again talking f2p), and for new accounts, you don't need to invest in energy and fusion since you can just run sats (if you count the cost for higher lvls of energy and fusion slot 8 becomes much cheaper to run, assuming you're not getting crashed).

    In the end, it comes down to mostly preference (and if you want to trade some deut to fleeters or be one yourself).


    Also the cost for running more cargos with slot 8 is technically significant (you can think of it as the same as investing in hyperspace) if given enough time you'll save enough deut in transports, it making it worth it.

    Slot 1 is horrible and should be avoided at all costs, last i checked it was something like 18% worse than slot 8 (probably even worse), and crystal mines take forever to pay off anyway, should only be used to get graviton and then deleted. In a universe without DM (no merchant/scrap) and forcing all trades to be done with players, i guess these might have some merit, as the crystal shortage would be insane, an interesting thought only.

    As Y0m1, numbers are a bit off.


    For a slot 15 to be on the same level as slot 8, you need the BEST setup (lowest temp in the range of -160, no fusion). Only then this slot will provide tiny bit more than slot 8 (and it is really tiny).


    Considering that slot 8 is free, it is the best "default" option. If you have DM to spend and prefer deut, then your own best option can be slot 15.

    Thx Y0m1 for pointing it out, my numbers are wrong -> should be:

    So, slot 8 productions with avg temp = 10 deg and only using sats, looks like this (1 day production):

    Metal = 43746312

    Deu = 8267472

    Translated to metal only = 43746312*1 + 8267472*3 = 68548728


    Slot 15, avg temp = -110 deg, fusion lvl 23 (90%) and solar plant lvl 30 (1 day production):

    Metal = 32404680

    Deu = 10917960

    Translated to metal only = 32404680*1 + 10917960*3 = 65158560


    I don't know what math flew into me :headbanging:


    And hence my argument does not hold completely for this case. But again, it's about temperatures, which are cheaper to get for slot 8. Obviously... And again, note that I'm being conservative. We can always turn the favor for slot 15 if we use fusion on slot 8 (yea, maybe not that good to do) and so on. So what temperature do I need? I found it to be -156 avg temp and WITH fusion. This, obviously, is hard to get on every planet compared with my case above (slot 8 with avg temp 10). The temperature might be lower for slot 8? I'm curious about it. If it's lower than 0 (as stated above), then (hands down) slot 8 wins. Slot 15 is somewhat comparable. But, it seems like slot 8 wins in most cases (if not all, maybe).


    Still, I would not say metal mines are much cheaper (both metal and crystal). The case: lvl 30 metal mine vs 30 deu synth is obvious that metal mine is much cheaper. But then the productions are not comparable. I'm talking about comparable productions (at least that is what I found to be interesting). There is a possibility that I misunderstood as well.

    So, the picture below presents cheaper both metal and crystal costs for deu synth:


    And full costs (same thing):

    This is true for comparable productions. We get the same result lvl 40 deu synth against lvl 44 metal mine.

    Note at these levels the deu synth starts to shine brighter. I know I know, hard to reach those levels, this was just a thought.

    So my point is, that the deu mine is cheaper (even if nothing to bother that much about) to get comparable results.

    I noticed something here (you probably already discovered it) the difference in metal costs is a factor 1.35. Almost as if this is designed to be so :gamer: Haha

    This also strengthens the case that deu synth is cheaper (but mainly in crystal), not much naturally.

    Thought of something just now. Do you mean that metal mine is cheaper in crystal costs due to that you need fusion and energy tech? If so, I agree. Then slot 8 wins here as well.


    Thx for enlightening me, my itch feels much better now.

    Lots of love :flowers:


    PS. Crystal mines sucks, buuu

    tbh if i started again i wouldn't move all my planet to 15 i would stay in 8 but i like to have all my planet close together and its easier to 16 systems in a row slot 15 then 8

    also i have spent a lot more on packages then i ever planned on


    but really unless you play everything else to the min-max its not worth going crazy about

    all it takes is someone hitting your sats or having a few drinks and leaving a few cargoes sitting on a moon and all your min-maxing is wasted

    Your calculation is completely wrong. I checked it on both on Proxy Calculator and in the game, conclusion is that slot 8 seems far superior to slot 15. Currently I have two planets on slot 15 with -159 to - 119 temperature and even with these temperatures they can't be better than a slot 8 planet so I decided to move them.