Feedback on the Updated Rule Clarifications

  • First of all, thank you to the team for taking the time to revisit and update the rule clarifications. Clear and consistent rules are important for everyone’s experience, and it’s great to see that some outdated parts are finally being addressed. That said, after reviewing the changes, I’d like to offer some constructive feedback on a few points—some of them are purely about clarity, others touch on deeper game mechanics that I believe deserve more attention.


    Note: The main rules thread (link) still contains the old clarifications, some of which directly contradict the newly published ones. It would really help to update or remove the outdated info to avoid confusion.



    Lobby Credentials

    The new clarification under "1. Accounts" rightly emphasizes the importance of account security, stating:

    Quote

    Remember to NEVER: Share your login data with anyone

    However, it would be helpful if this also explicitly stated that sharing your lobby credentials with another person is not only discouraged but also forbidden under the rules and ToS. This kind of clarity would especially help newer players, who may not realize that even with trust, account sharing is a violation.



    Same Household Clarification

    This change is a positive one. Allowing players in the same household to play together (under the right conditions) is a step in the right direction. Restricting their trades to 3:2:1 is a sensible measure to prevent abuse, namely, the old "my wife/son/dog is playing this account" scenario.


    That said, one part of the clarification reads:

    "It is not allowed to log into each other’s accounts, on purpose or accidentally."

    The phrasing here is odd. An accident is, by definition, not intentional. Penalizing players for something done by accident, without malicious intent, seems harsh and confusing. If the intent is to discourage carelessness, maybe rephrase it to something like “It is the responsibility of each player to prevent accidental logins into other accounts.”



    Account Sitting

    The updated clarification outlines some of what a sitter can and cannot do, but it still leaves too many gray areas. There are many actions—like sending expeditions—that fall into neither the "allowed" nor "forbidden" lists.


    Rather than trying to list everything a sitter may or may not do, I think it would be clearer and more future-proof to simply define what they are allowed to do. Anything outside that scope would be automatically not permitted.



    Pushing/Pulling – The Core Problem

    This is where the current clarification still falls short.

    • First, I don’t think there’s a strong reason anymore to distinguish between pushing (lower to higher ranked) and pulling (higher to lower ranked). They are essentially two sides of the same coin and could be covered under a unified rule about resource transfer limits.

    • Second, I think the decision to still allow trades anywhere between 3:2:1 and 2:1:1 is outdated. We all have access to free merchants via expeditions, and getting 3:2:1 rates is no longer a limitation. The amount of resources floating around in the game is enormous, and 3:2:1 trades would not hurt anyone. Any fleeter claiming otherwise is—let’s be honest—just making excuses.


    The clarification also says:

    Quote

    It is forbidden to manipulate legal trade rates to give an unfair advantage to a higher-ranked player. Examples (not limited to):

    • Buying resources at high prices and selling them back at lower ones.
    • Selling a scrapped fleet or defense at unfavorable trade ratios.

    This feels outdated. The focus on scrap pushing shows that the team still views pushing in terms of practices that peaked years ago. Scrap pushing has largely disappeared—not because the rules are effective, but because metal pack pushing is easier and more effective. The abuse has evolved, and the rules need to reflect that.


    What we regularly see now is a pattern of players passing large volumes of resources through 2:1:1 trades that are later flipped via merchant at 3:2:1, which effectively nullifies the pushing/pulling restrictions. This happens especially when high-economy accounts acquire large amounts of metal and funnel it toward other players under the guise of legal trade.


    This happens all the time. The clarification technically says it’s forbidden to “manipulate legal trade rates,” but we all know that it’s practically unenforceable because the support tools can’t track or prove the abuse reliably.


    And here’s the solution that would fix 90% of the headache:

    Fix trade ratios to 3:2:1.


    It’s simple. It’s enforceable. It prevents most abuse. And it removes the gray zone that causes endless disputes and support tickets. I genuinely don’t understand why this hasn’t been implemented yet—it’s one of the most obvious ways to promote fair play.


    In fact, you’ve already applied 3:2:1 enforcement to same-household trades—which shows that you’re aware of how powerful (and abusable) unrestricted rates are. Why not extend that to all trades? It would:

    • Make the rules easier to enforce

    • Remove most of the ambiguity

    • Eliminate a major vector for abuse

    • Improve fairness across the board



    Again, I appreciate the effort the team put into updating the clarifications. But the game has changed, and the way rules are enforced needs to evolve with it. A bit more clarity, consistency, and alignment with how the game is actually played today would go a long way toward making things fairer and more transparent.

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    Rumors are carried by haters, spread by fools, and accepted by idiots.


    Developer of AntiGameReborn - Link to the AGR Discord

  • What kinda mind thought that killing trade between the players is good idea? Wasn't the best idea to put trade ratio on average ratio 2.5 1.5 1 that for years was the best and most fair, not to mention that most fleeters used those rates to trade,you are practically killing it basics of fleeters growth..or starting with every uni everyone should become first miners or just the most ideal way for GF buy themselves mines or possibly deut packs to actually fleet?Not to mention that in uni1 where deut is costly and df is low so you are practically already doomed..I m sincerely lost for words on what this community is becoming,how we have only those rules, merges without any care for players base..

    Lurking from the shadows

  • I feel like the trade rate change does not make any sense, and that is coming from a deut seller, so technically I would benefit.


    I think this will just kill trading between players. Why would you set up trades and have to find sellers when you can just merch it? It's just another player interaction that is being removed for no reason.

    Also, if 3:2:1 is the only allowed ratio, surely the merchant can only offer that trade rate.


    The true reason for its introduction is to reduce pulling (as tirnoch is describing), which only benefits GF and not the players anyway.

    The introduction to the original pulling rule was the same; the decision only considering GF's pockets.


    At this point, just ban transferring resources between players and be done with it. Also pushing will still happen, when people are known to have been running multiple accounts they'll farm from time to time.



    If anything, we should be moving away from using tools like the merchant to trade and force more player interaction. I would be in favour of removing trader altogether, but that would require a massive rework on resource balance/production.

  • Y0m1 wrote everything quite clear :thumbsup:. So basically everyone has 5 more days to cheat a bit with merching scams :fatgreengrin:. Idk why the ratio is even at 3:2:1. It's more like 8:1.3:1 by how production is balanced or something in that ratio :blackeye:

  • I can see the very sensible arguments for fixing the ratio between players but it does kill an element of the game that has been established along time, particularly if fixed at 3/2/1 (i.e., the best rate you get at the merchant). I would also like to see a range applied rather than a fixed rate - as others have suggested between 2.5/1.5/1 and 3/2/1 would be a fair base. This change as currently implemented will make it very hard for small to medium fleeters to play the game and fuel their ships. There should also be an incentive for interacting with other players to trade rather than just using the merchant imo, which a range would allow for.

    Hopefully this can be tweaked to a sensible level.

  • What kinda mind thought that killing trade between the players is good idea? Wasn't the best idea to put trade ratio on average ratio 2.5 1.5 1 that for years was the best and most fair, not to mention that most fleeters used those rates to trade,you are practically killing it basics of fleeters growth..or starting with every uni everyone should become first miners or just the most ideal way for GF buy themselves mines or possibly deut packs to actually fleet?Not to mention that in uni1 where deut is costly and df is low so you are practically already doomed..I m sincerely lost for words on what this community is becoming,how we have only those rules, merges without any care for players base..

    Fleeters using 2.5:1.5:1 in the past did so in lower eco, 30% DF universes, without General class, and without Lifeforms. The General class brought Attacker-Wreckfield and deut reduction. Lifeforms later added even more deut savings. And today, 8x economy is the standard. So we now have more deut, more savings, and more fleet recovery than ever before. Fleeters managed with less. They can absolutely manage with 3:2:1 trades now.


    I think this will just kill trading between players. Why would you set up trades and have to find sellers when you can just merch it?

    Because merchant costs DM. Trading with players at 3:2:1 doesn't. It saves you DM and allows interaction with other players. The new rule doesn’t remove trading — it just removes the ability to abuse trade ratios for disguised resource transfers.


    The true reason for its introduction is to reduce pulling (as tirnoch is describing), which only benefits GF and not the players anyway.

    The introduction to the original pulling rule was the same; the decision only considering GF's pockets.

    This is incorrect. Pulling (just like pushing) gives one player a huge advantage at the expense of others. That’s not about GF’s pockets — it’s about fairness. If someone uses their alt or a paid pack buyer to funnel resources through “legal” trades, that affects all other players in that universe. Preventing it helps keep a level playing field.


    I can see the very sensible arguments for fixing the ratio between players but it does kill an element of the game that has been established along time, particularly if fixed at 3/2/1 (i.e., the best rate you get at the merchant). I would also like to see a range applied rather than a fixed rate - as others have suggested between 2.5/1.5/1 and 3/2/1 would be a fair base. This change as currently implemented will make it very hard for small to medium fleeters to play the game and fuel their ships. There should also be an incentive for interacting with other players to trade rather than just using the merchant imo, which a range would allow for.

    The issue is — we already had a range. Trades between 2:1:1 and 3:2:1 were technically allowed, and that range is exactly what enabled the abuse. Players used 2:1:1 rates to funnel resources under the guise of legal trading, making it nearly impossible to prove pushing or pulling.


    So proposing a new range doesn't actually fix anything — it just recreates the same loophole, only maybe slightly smaller. If you allow a range, you might as well not change the rule at all. That’s why the decision was made to lock it down: a fixed ratio removes ambiguity and makes enforcement possible.


    Also, again: players were fine running fleets on 2.5:1.5:1 long before we had:

    • General class (with Attacker-Wreckfield and deut reduction),
    • Lifeform techs (with even more deut reduction),
    • 8x eco (the norm today).

    There is simply more deut in circulation than ever before. 3:2:1 is not a burden — it’s just a step toward preventing abuse and making things fairer for everyone.

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    Rumors are carried by haters, spread by fools, and accepted by idiots.


    Developer of AntiGameReborn - Link to the AGR Discord

  • But you forget that both parties have agreed on those trades, either party can ask for maximum or deny it.Nobody is forcing anyone to trade on 2:1:1 ,if its damaging for one side that side agrees,if one side trades for maximum 3:2:1 thats the problem or not for the both trading parties involved in the trade. Simply neither one side is forcing anyone to trade on different ratios,its matter if choice or what they agree.Its what trading world is all about.

    Lurking from the shadows

  • But you forget that both parties have agreed on those trades, either party can ask for maximum or deny it.Nobody is forcing anyone to trade on 2:1:1 ,if its damaging for one side that side agrees,if one side trades for maximum 3:2:1 thats the problem or not for the both trading parties involved in the trade. Simply neither one side is forcing anyone to trade on different ratios,its matter if choice or what they agree.Its what trading world is all about.

    You're absolutely right that normally, in a fair trade, both parties agree on the terms and no one is forced into anything. But that's not what this rule change is about.


    The issue isn't about regular, organic trading between players. It's about intentional loophole abuse, where both parties willingly cooperate to funnel resources in one direction — usually from a high economy/miner account to a main account — under the guise of "legal" trade.


    In many of these cases, there's real money involved. One player buys metal packs or otherwise accumulates resources and sells them off at skewed rates like 2:1:1 to another player, who then uses the merchant at 3:2:1. That margin is how the system is gamed. And because both parties are complicit, the Game Team has almost no way to prove it's pushing or pulling.


    So yes, consent exists — but it’s coordinated abuse, not normal player interaction. That’s why locking trade rates at 3:2:1 is necessary. It removes the ambiguity and closes a loophole that has undermined fair play for years.

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    Rumors are carried by haters, spread by fools, and accepted by idiots.


    Developer of AntiGameReborn - Link to the AGR Discord

  • I agree with Firestorm, why would a fleeter bother with a 3:2:1 rate when they are running low on deut they can ship the metal down to planet and merch it at 3:2:1 - costing just DM as opposed to sending a transport which is costing the fleeter deut and a precious fleet slot, make the minimum rates more sensible at 2.5/1.5/1 ...

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    Best Solo - 21.1 bn Profit - Uni1.org
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  • Well there is also option of removing merchant from game so no one can abuse it :fatgreengrin::fatgreengrin::fatgreengrin:. Imagine what our great majestic whales think about that :lol:

  • Fleeters using 2.5:1.5:1 in the past did so in lower eco, 30% DF universes, without General class, and without Lifeforms. The General class brought Attacker-Wreckfield and deut reduction. Lifeforms later added even more deut savings. And today, 8x economy is the standard. So we now have more deut, more savings, and more fleet recovery than ever before. Fleeters managed with less. They can absolutely manage with 3:2:1 trades now.

    Fleeters can survive just fine on 3:2:1, it's not even that big a change, honestly, but your point about all the new things that got added just meant the fleets grew to match them.

    I can only speak for uni 1 because that's what I play, but here have full deut consumption and 30% DF without deut to df. And we have ridiculous fleets of 100s of millions of BCs flying around.


    But I assume in the other unis it will be quite similar where there's always those willing to pack it up to insane amounts, you really think deut costs matter to them? They'll just merch a couple more metal packs so they can fly.

    This is incorrect. Pulling (just like pushing) gives one player a huge advantage at the expense of others. That’s not about GF’s pockets — it’s about fairness. If someone uses their alt or a paid pack buyer to funnel resources through “legal” trades, that affects all other players in that universe. Preventing it helps keep a level playing field.

    Your main issue seems to be with packs and multis. Any p2w game is unfair, this one is an especially egregious case because it's pvp and the p2w aspect is so large you'll never be able to compete as a f2p account (or even if you spend "reasonable amounts").

    If fairness was a concern here we would not be playing the game anyway. Multis are an issue, but I disagree with the pulling thing. Does it matter to you that someone can buy cheaper packs if the end result is the same? They are not the same for everyone anyway, different people will have different amounts they can/are willing to pay for the game anyway. Or are you going to say it's unfair if a millionaire decides to dump 5m € on the game and eclipse everyone? Since packs are a thing, there will never be a level playing field.

    Btw there is much easier fix for this, make packs give a fixed amount not dependent on your own mines, with some formula dependent on universe average production or age or something, doesn't really matter. But we all know that will never happen.


    Because merchant costs DM. Trading with players at 3:2:1 doesn't. It saves you DM and allows interaction with other players. The new rule doesn’t remove trading — it just removes the ability to abuse trade ratios for disguised resource transfers.

    DM cost for merchant is basically nothing

    Let's say you merch once per week at average (way more than required, at least in my case, I merch maybe once per month) 15k per merch, that's 60k a month (you can easily sustain this as pure f2p account)

    Let's compare to some other things you need if you want to stay competitive:

    As miner geo - 41.6k a month (buying 3 months)
    As a disco - 16.6k (admiral) + 314k (expo bosters) + 105 (fleet slot bosters)

    Anytime you need to go for a big tech (i.e. astro, mine is currently like 5 years waiting time) - almost 400k to insta research.



    People pay way more for QoL things, and you think fleeters will bother with trading at all? Just merch all the deut you need, the cost will be the same anyway.

    Currently there's at least a reason for fleeters to look for trades, which creates interaction, you think if the rates are the same they'll go through all that just to save like 15k DM? If you're running low on deut, just send some ress to your planet, merch all the deut you'll need for the month and fly it back to the moon, 5 minutes and you're done.

  • I wonder if all the :censored: By King Rabbit btmi are mysteriously going to vmode now they are not allowed that useful.


    Certified whale account here - id get rid of merchant in a heart beat.


    I actually prefer fixed rates... And 3:2:1 is fine as for me, our smaller miners will now grow faster and bring our whole team along further.

    In Muppets or whatever we are called now we had minimum rates anyway for trades (higher than 2:1:1), so this just takes that further

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    Edited 2 times, last by King Rabbit ().

  • I wonder if all the multis in btmi are mysteriously going to vmode now they are not allowed that useful.

    Zero Mutis in BTMI not 1 Your usually pretty funny but this just shows you know nothing and just a mouth...

    Yeah of course, not a single one.

    How do I send giant winks though the boards...asking for a... [Insert relationship type here]

    #FreeArcane

    Stuck in Pagan's room of "I cant deal with this" since 2024

    The best thing to happen to Muppets since discovering Womens wrists are smaller than Mens.




  • I wonder if all the multis in btmi are mysteriously going to vmode now they are not allowed that useful.

    Zero Mutis in BTMI not 1 Your usually pretty funny but this just shows you know nothing and just a mouth...

    Yeah of course, not a single one.

    How do I send giant winks though the boards...asking for a... [Insert relationship type here]

    See your just not that funny anymore just hot air.

    th?id=OIP.ntetCVhzyqC59keaaH2msgHaBX&pid=Api&P=0&h=220

  • Perhaps the range needs to be narrower, but I think you must have a range. If players are forced to trade at the highest level offered by the merchant then there is no reason to trade, unless perhaps you play a 0 DM game. This rule change essentially bans trades between players by proxy.

    I do really appreciate where you are coming from Tirnoch with the point about abuse, but making significant changes to many legitimate players’ gameplay to tackle a minority of aggressive abusers seems to be the wrong answer to me. I think there will be a range available which will allow players to still play their game but which will stymie the abuse you are targeting by making trades between players broadly even to that of the merchant. 3:2:1 is not the answer.