Posts by Langston

Quote from Song

Quote from piink

The max eco allowed is x8. x10 was a special server opening.

The max research is 16 ( 8x2- if the eco is x8).

Ok than,x8 eco research 16x and 50 df plus 0.5 cons deut

I support all of this. Not a fan of the super high DF as it just encourages vmode fleeting more. 50% is fine though. Def need whatever the max eco is

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Summary attackers(s)

Metal: 1.633.086.259

Crystal: 1.761.881.736

Deuterium: 1.457.021.358

The attacker(s) made a profit of 4.851.989.353 units.

Can't argue with this profit numbers or ratios

Nice smash mates, next time I'll be around to help out,

FR DEF

Quote from Tom.zanetti

ive had 3 pirate hits in roughly 100 expo. using 2.15-1 LF-LC 1 reaper and 1 pathfinder. am i just very unlucky? or is there a better fleet comp?

fleet comp is irrelevant to outcome. I.e no matter what you send you have the same chance of finding DM, Ships, getting a battle, etc. different compositions such as mass amounts of LF LC at whatever ratio just increases the yield of certain outcomes (battles) through infinite scaling. However the percent chance of a battle is independent of what you send. So yeah just unlucky, average would be 8-9 battles in 100 expos typically.

Just make it such that the hold time is much more expensive, not the flight cost itself

It has almost nothing to do with fleet comp and everything to do with expos instead. Large amounts of LF and LC, or BC allow fleeters to farm expos for pirate/Alien battles where they harvest the DF for easy profit PvE.

the days of building a fleet that’s balanced and suited to taking out other fleeters is gone. That’s why you see the way they are now.

Of course, the other advantage is it’s usually much more profitable to send a few thousand/hundred thousand LF along with say 1,000 bs to crack a planets defenses than it is to send 20k destroyers deut to deut cost and relative losses. Though this likely isn’t the reason anymore since v7

Quote from Universal_soldier

I am bit confused about all this but then maybe someone can enlighten me.

Attacker wasted deu knowing no profits could be made. Defender knew he would make losses but mentions its bait.

Wouldnt it be a bait if attacker got hit on the return if you were setting it up for him to bite?

From resources captured it seems you were able to move your resources otherwise attacker wouldnt see a point to attack.

Still confused:)

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I fs between rounds of expos due to having attacker and gonzo 1sys away from a deploy of mine. Attacker assumed I was fs to own DF at 10% but wrongly assumed I wouldn’t recall or send a cover fleet. He watched for DF to vanish and locked “my fleet” on the return. My fleet was back and moved over 5min before the hit, I timed recy to pick up DF so in the end maybe I even profited a little in exchange for some moon defense, but it’s not about that. It’s about the fun of the game

I noticed it, but only because I sold a large chunk of fleet at once and saw it go up.

I am not positive but it would make sense that found ships count as built, same as bought would. But not certain on that.

However I don’t think it really matters. Expos shouldn’t count towards military destroyed but they do, so if one of the stats is messed up doesn’t make much a difference if they all are. I’d prefer they spend their time fixing some of the bigger issues than worrying about fixing something like that

Quote from killer73

Quote from Langston

The Crawler is not an early game unit, neither is the collector class so right there most of what you said makes no sense.

If the number of crawlers you can use scales on the total mine levels that right there should tell you one thing. Secondly, energy is an issue until you can reliably either produce "safe" energy through fusion+energy tech which again wont happen till lategame, or you can protect your large number of sats- which in a 60% DF uni without merchant thats crystal starved.... good luck

Instead try basing your numbers off an actual mid/lategame miner, Ill use one of my weaker planets in Quantum for example which is same eco speed. 42-36-39 mine levels is 936 crawlers at a cost of 46,800 energy. They produce 96.6/31.16/~32 per crawler (pays for itself in about 2 days).

I'm not sure why you are trying to compare the production per unit energy between mines and crawlers...mines are intended to be the main source of resource income and are indestructible that is why they cost so much, crawlers are a bonus they should not be more efficient than mines on their own and the come at a cost and risk just like solar sats do. I dont think crawlers themselves need buffs at all because thats buffing every class. I think theyre pretty decent now, what needs buffing is the class bonus or % increase for collectors themselves. An exclusive buff.

Crawlers are not weak- you would just be weak for choosing collector in a starting uni (if thats what you did) over discoverer. Either way you are way too early into the uni to be reaping any kind of sizable rewards from your crawlers at this time focus on getting your mines and research up so you can transition into fusion reactors to power your crawlers safely later on.

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I agree with most of what you say apart from the fact a class should not have been made which is not beginner friendly and does not make for good new player retention. In that aspect gameforge has already failed at bringing in new players, retaining them and receiving financial reward from that customer over time.
If they made a class which you regret within a week and want to switch most new players will see that as a time to quit rather than pay for a game they are not yet emotionally connected to.

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How would you describe the General class then? Its class ship is the 2nd to last ship unlocked and costs the most of any non-deathstar ship. Thats not an earlygame class really is it?

There is absolutely no doubt this class system was not thought through enough and is not being balanced for continuous game play. Discoverer has been broken for months now and not a single real change has been made about it. Those can complain all they want about being lied to and mislead about the "3% increase yield" part but at this point Octans came out well after everyone knew about it so if you dont pick disco in a new uni thats your fault to be fair.

Also my comments pertained to the crawlers, not collector. But it should be obvious that something that gives you a 50% bonus on a given rate gets better the higher that rate is (i.e lategame miner) where as something that gives a higher- yet flat rate (expos) would be better in the early game.

To fix the class system simply either adjust expo DF to 10% from 20%/cap the SI of pirate/alien finds. And give eco bonus to every class and boom disco now actually rewards those who play more and collector isnt the bastard step child in comparison and general isnt just a switch-to-before-a-top10 class.

The Crawler is not an early game unit, neither is the collector class so right there most of what you said makes no sense.

If the number of crawlers you can use scales on the total mine levels that right there should tell you one thing. Secondly, energy is an issue until you can reliably either produce "safe" energy through fusion+energy tech which again wont happen till lategame, or you can protect your large number of sats- which in a 60% DF uni without merchant thats crystal starved.... good luck

Instead try basing your numbers off an actual mid/lategame miner, Ill use one of my weaker planets in Quantum for example which is same eco speed. 42-36-39 mine levels is 936 crawlers at a cost of 46,800 energy. They produce 96.6/31.16/~32 per crawler (pays for itself in about 2 days).

I'm not sure why you are trying to compare the production per unit energy between mines and crawlers...mines are intended to be the main source of resource income and are indestructible that is why they cost so much, crawlers are a bonus they should not be more efficient than mines on their own and the come at a cost and risk just like solar sats do. I dont think crawlers themselves need buffs at all because thats buffing every class. I think theyre pretty decent now, what needs buffing is the class bonus or % increase for collectors themselves. An exclusive buff.

Crawlers are not weak- you would just be weak for choosing collector in a starting uni (if thats what you did) over discoverer. Either way you are way too early into the uni to be reaping any kind of sizable rewards from your crawlers at this time focus on getting your mines and research up so you can transition into fusion reactors to power your crawlers safely later on.

Till they fix the eco speed loot bonus for non-discoverers which AFAIK hasnt been fixed... then i dont think It really matters a whole lot...

For disco max yield is said to be 2300 LC + 1 PF, but keep in mind in quantum that means that a discoverer sending a pathfinder gets 1(regular)*2(pathfinder)*7(eco multiplyer)*1.5(class bonus) for a total of 21x standard yield

A collector is limited to 1(regular)*2(pathfinder) = 2x yeild. so 2-300LC should still do it since you're getting 10-11x less loot in terms of resources and ships. DM finds, and item finds are the same, and pirate/alien DF are halved but that doesn't matter if you're just sending cargos.

Always make sure to send the pathfinder for the 2x bonus, probe doesnt do much but tell you more detailed messages about if the system is exhausted (which rarely happens as it refreshes so frequently), and the bomber/destroyer/reaper just allows you to find stronger combat ships but does not change the SI of the find. If youre just a miner you might be better off not sending one of those so you only find cargos+LF+HF, etc.

Quote from lungustefan

Quote from Langston

Hopefully these upload with a resolution you can see...

Using a slightly modified version of Grimm spreadsheet. Thanks for that mate.

The first is from back in feb when I first changed to disco from collector. This for me was during "normal life" I managed around 5 waves per day I believe. Accomplishing ~500 expo in a little over a week.

Fleet comp was usually 2-2.5k LC, 1PF, 1 reaper/dessie. (max res find is rare and is usually only metal so needing 2300 LC isn't *required* imo...but some expo expert feel free to correct me as to why im wrong lol)

This is from the last three days. Obviously have more time to send since working from home and cant go anywhere so average around 8 waves per day. Sending generally 4x 300k LF 70K LC 1PF and 4x ~90K HF 70K LC 1PF. About the same DF results from either. Losses are higher cause I sprinkle in probes for increases crystal yields.

I calculated that if i finished the Metal 44, Crystal 37, Deut 40 x14 that I am going for, collector class alone (just the +25% and the crawler boost- not crawlers themselves) I earn about 72m metal, 21m crys, 21m deut. Using the average per expo gain from feb converted to a single resource (metal or deut) that works out to about 30-31 expos per day to break even on an acc with over 300m exo in a 7x eco uni.

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at the second part, when yo send in the big fleet, did you take into account the res needed to replace the lost ships to pirates and black holes?

meaning when you look at that average total res per expedition, does that take into account the repair costs?

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The first image is a little off due to improper formatting of certain sections(ignore the scrapping ships part), but the final res gain is correct.

In the second image I fixed most of the issues so everything is correct. It accounts for ships lost which is why I said that actual profit is a little higher due to im not building any ships im just finding replacement LF, HF, LC, and probes on ships finds to replace those lost in battles.

Blackholes are not accounted for, they have a 1/500 chance (so i've heard) ive only hit like 1-2 in almost 2 months and both luckily were when it was just a cargo expo. If you want to include those then take my profit off those 180 expos and multiply it up to what it would be for 500 expos, then subtract the cost to build one wave. You end up with around 3.6bn metal 2.05bn crystal at an expense of 725m deut. Still huge profit.

Also, keep in mind the optimal ratio of LF:LC is said to be 2:1, not sure what it is for HF:LC but im running at a 5:1 ratio more or less so you could easily make more profit.

Sad to see you hit Grimm.. normally I don't like turtles but you're different and that turtle is an amazing feat. Glad they didn't include more rips and that you had officers to minimize losses keep up the hard work

Attackers, Impressive amount of balls. smart planning and cant argue with that amount of profit to effort and deut ratio. Congrats on the New Top 10

Hopefully these upload with a resolution you can see...

Using a slightly modified version of Grimm spreadsheet. Thanks for that mate.

The first is from back in feb when I first changed to disco from collector. This for me was during "normal life" I managed around 5 waves per day I believe. Accomplishing ~500 expo in a little over a week.

Fleet comp was usually 2-2.5k LC, 1PF, 1 reaper/dessie. (max res find is rare and is usually only metal so needing 2300 LC isn't *required* imo...but some expo expert feel free to correct me as to why im wrong lol)

This is from the last three days. Obviously have more time to send since working from home and cant go anywhere so average around 8 waves per day. Sending generally 4x 300k LF 70K LC 1PF and 4x ~90K HF 70K LC 1PF. About the same DF results from either. Losses are higher cause I sprinkle in probes for increases crystal yields.

I calculated that if i finished the Metal 44, Crystal 37, Deut 40 x14 that I am going for, collector class alone (just the +25% and the crawler boost- not crawlers themselves) I earn about 72m metal, 21m crys, 21m deut. Using the average per expo gain from feb converted to a single resource (metal or deut) that works out to about 30-31 expos per day to break even on an acc with over 300m exo in a 7x eco uni.

I too play quantum, top 60 points+eco.

I ran the numbers and even before this DF farming became a thing approx 3-4 waves (something like 30 individual expos?) was the break even point of collector vs discoverer for me.

Sending on average like 6-8 waves of just LC per day(pre-quarantine) I could pull 3-500m additional profit ontop of mine production easy- average was 5m res per expo. Since building up a small fleet for DF farming I now average about 1million per day(though at a cost of all my deut prod), new average is about 15m per expo.

I’ve seen the higher end results, it scales ridiculously. When I get a battle it’s 100-150m DF, when the big fleeters do it’s 1-2bn+.

there’s a risk with building the fleet to do combat expos, and it’s good to keep in mind you likely won’t have the same amount of free time once life returns to “normal” so ask yourself what play style you want and if you can manage 4 waves per day and not get burned out when operating on your normal day to day life

EDIT: I can share specific numbers if you would like as I track all my expo/acc data

Quote from johocknut

Yeah I’m guessing that’s an April fools prank.

GF can barely put in the effort to test their updates and patches to find and fix exploits, strange that they'd put so much effort into a joke...

Also some of the ideas i think are actually pretty cool like inter-alliance technologies, the war system, the general class buffs, etc.

But laser missile, Thermoregulator, and sharing alliance fleets? lmao

Every new uni has hundreds of players at first. Check back in a month those numbers will be half that.

I only play here so idk how Q compares to others but I’d say it’s decently active. That 50 is pretty consistent throughout the day since v7 released.

Generally speaking if you join now you won’t find others wanting to “trade ms” since it’s a fairly developed uni, however there are plenty of active players that will help you out if you ask.

Will also take this time to offer my aid to any new players. I’ll be more generous that others and help with multiple moons and initial res donations for things like Nantes, etc. just shoot me a PM so I know what you need ingame nick is the same as forums

Though it is advertised that way, i dont believe it to be that way. Its same frequency but 9x the loot find as it has been in the past

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From: Fleet Command
We found the remains of an alien ship. We found a little container with some Dark Matter on a shelf in the cargo hold!



Dark Matter 6.228 have been captured.



Entry from the communications officers logbook: It seems that this part of the universe has not been explored yet.

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Crash probably just send his expos a little too early before the event officially started, despite the message from the server